Bagel Belly Blog

Hmmm, I got quite excited when I saw this, but I think I agree with you - it's a lost opportunity.

I'm currently musing over two major problems for this household (my Mum's). The first is the TV situation. Right now we've got a pretty old TV (only 1 SCART input), a pretty old VCR (only has 1 SCART output, and no input or pass-thru), a Freeview box (coax + 1 SCART output), and a cheap DVD player (1 SCART output). To watch DVDs, we have to disconnect the Freeview box. To record from Freeview channels we have to remember to (i) leave the box on, and (ii) disconnect the SCART connection from the TV if we want to watch something else on a terrestrial analog channel at the same time.

What would be really good would be something relatively cheap (<UKP 350, I guess) that would replace everything apart from the TV. We could probably survive without VCR playback. Even better would be if it could solve the other problem too, which is computing. I'm fed up with having to maintain 'doze boxes for my mother, just so she can keep her accounts on it and write the occasional letter, and to be honest all I need these days it web and email (IMAP) access. I figure it wouldn't be too painful to use a infrared keyboard / mouse combo with the TV for that..

I disagree about wired networking - if you're ever going to use it as a PVR and want to shunt video (either to/from a jukebox, or streaming), shunt audio or have a stable internet connection, wired is pretty necessary (specially for video). I agree about the modem port - if necessary, just get a USB modem (ditto for the wired, I guess, if the USB can run quickly enough).

There are a couple of things I would have liked to see on it:

1. proper audio. Headphone out is useless; people link these to "Line in", but those people are wrong. Should be 5.1 sound in and out; SPDIF would suffice.

2. power button. on the back. wtf? Should be around the front, where you can get to it. Also needs an IR receiver for a remote control.

3. proper video. DVI out is nice, but there's no video capture. A radeon 9200 is nice and free software friendly (thanks Apple! :), but not going to set the gaming world alight - they could have put in an all-in-wonder type solution

I guess it depends on whether or not people are going to use these things as real computers. I suspect they are a bit stillborn for home entertainment, even as a simple mp3 juke. Not making me want one over a mini ATX.

Quick x86 price comparison, 'cos I know you Macheads love them

Scan's ChyangFun Mac Cube rip-off (same footprint as the Mac Mini, but about 3 inches higher?) is £175 inc VAT. 2.4GHz Celery, 1/2Gb Ram, 120Gb HD. Similar connectors, inc. s-video and composite built in and SPDIF digital audio. Slot for a graphics card and one other additional, so it could be made to do video capture reasonably easily....

Mac Mini looks nicer, and comes with software. I think it will sell reasonably, but maybe not amazingly.

http://www.livejournal.com/community/macosx/3402707.html

*ducks and runs*

Why does everyone want to use their computer through a TV? Have you all forgotten the horrible days of the Amiga through the TV? Do you really want to return to 768*576?

Steve D, grab a SCART switcher box for 20 quid for your mum!

Savs, for viewing your content on your TV check out,

http://store.apple.com/Apple/WebObjects/ukstore.woa/90801/wo/1i59SbiaFbk828XvzPi1fndCjbK/0.0.11.1.0.6.21.1.10.1.0.0.0.1.0

aid

Ok, so. After some thought on the subject .... ;-)

Jeremy was first to give me feedback in chat, and as he quite reasonably points out, the product I want is not the product Apple released. To be fair to the mini, it's a great solution for most PC-replacement scenarios, and I think it'd be a perfect way to move my family over to the Mac platform.

My only quibble from that point of view is that is it just ain't that cheap: by the time you add in the wifi (both family computers have USB wireless (http://www.linksys.com/products/product.asp?grid=33&scid=36&prid=435) which isn't compatible with OS X), and USB keyboard and mouse (although reasonably new, both family computers lack USB keyboard/mouse), the cost is �426. That's still pretty cheap, except it's really easy to find a PC bundle deal that surpasses it: a quick glance at PC World shows me Intel Celeron 2.7 GHz Processor, 256Mb RAM, 40Gb Hard Disk, CDRW/DVDROM Combo Drive, 17 Inch CRT Monitor, Integrated Intel Extreme Graphics for �329. As Alex points out, there's other cheaper solutions.

Now the whole is it / isn't it a good solution as a media center. I hadn't noticed the lack of line-out, which sucks. I'll graciously agree that the wired ethernet should stay, with the proviso that it'd be better if it was a firewire 800 port... I think more people would want to plug in cameras etc. rather than network devices. And power button on the back ... well, yeah, but would you ever turn it off?

Adrian, what you're missing is that most TVs do better resolutions nowadays. Mine gives a crystal-clear picture when plugged into the Mac, and it's much more convenient to do a quick bit of web browsing on that than to head upstairs... just assume there's no LCD on my laptop for a minute ;-) Also, though the EyeHome device you link to is pretty cool, it's missing the ability to record shows straight off the TV, or to do time-shifting a la tivo. I want a tivo, but the only option is a Sky+ box in the UK, and I refuse to encourage their monopolistic exploitation of the market, preferring instead to encourage the monopolistic exploits of Apple....

I quite like it, in that I want one to add as another computer to my (Linux) desktop and it would be handy to learn Mac OS X properly. What got me was I already have the mouse+keyboard but don't want to get rid of my Linux desktop (that I also dualboot with XP for a few games) so I looked into getting a KVM that supports USB keyboard/mouse etc. turns out I need to find another 80 quid. It is a shame that Apple didn't provide some kind of built in USB KVM with the new Mac-mini given that they are trying to pitch it as a way to upgrade to Mac from XP (or whatever) as I doubt most people would want to drop in the Mac and ditch the PC straight away it would be nice to have a way to share that keyboard+mouse+screen. Also what Andrew said about us being screwed on the price is right, the Mac-mini is about 40 quid too much and a couple of other things put me off, the built in ethernet isn't gigabit (yeah I don't have a gig-e switch yet but they are getting cheaper) and also isn't there a new release of Mac OS X just around the corner? I would be really pissed to buy one of these to have Apple release Tiger in the next couple of months and want to charge me 100 quid to upgrade to it. I really do want one of these though, just to play with just a shame that it will cost me more than 400 quid.

Adrian: yeah, was thinking about that but it doesn't solve most of the problems. It seems a bit silly to still be recording to VHS in this day and age, and I don't know whether it's worth going down the DVD recorder route (with the issue of the insane multiplicity of media formats) when a PVR might suit us all a lot better. It would also be good to get rid of some of the boxes and all the knitting that are breeding around the TV :)

Hmmm, I think I have to agree all except ethernet port bits. My wireless kits need Windows to install, no Mac support. If there is ethernet connection I can hook up to the wireless client, so that I can set up anywhere.

Either way, I won't buy miniMac until OS becomes Tigar. Price in Japan is 58,590 yen. - roughly $90 top-up. That said, knowing how difficult it is to make Japanese environment, I have to say that's fair amount.